how does cure with ECA protect meat before its released
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nolannn said in how does cure with ECA protect meat before its released:
But nothing really stops the growth till then?
The salt added to the meat works to inhibit bacterial growth. Salt works by drawing water out of the protein and also draws water through the cell walls of any bacteria that might be present.
The changes in available water disrupts the bacteria so they can’t multiply quickly, even in a smoker, and makes the meat a less hospitable place for them to grow.
Paul
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nolannn said in how does cure with ECA protect meat before its released:
But nothing really stops the growth till then?
The salt added to the meat works to inhibit bacterial growth. Salt works by drawing water out of the protein and also draws water through the cell walls of any bacteria that might be present.
The changes in available water disrupts the bacteria so they can’t multiply quickly, even in a smoker, and makes the meat a less hospitable place for them to grow.
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If it takes 24 hours for the cure to be done yet can be smoked immediately in a dark warm smoker when the meat is still moist. The ECA only begins its work after the meat is 130 degrees.
If the cure hasn’t sat the time it needs to work and encapsulation has kept the CA from working til 130, what’s up?
I believe there’s got to be an answer.Maybe the citric acid weakens what grows and the cure doesn’t have to be at full strength after The CA is released because the bacteria is weak.
I’m just guessingnolannn said in how does cure with ECA protect meat before its released:
Maybe the citric acid weakens what grows and the cure doesn’t have to be at full strength after The CA is released because the bacteria is weak.
I’m just guessingCitric acid works as a cure accelerator, ECA works by lowering the PH of the final meat product. The bacteria does not get weak, we change the environment to unfavorable when we add cure, salt, sugar, citric acid, ECA, smoke, and a lack of moisture thus limiting its ability to reproduce.
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This link sheds some more light on curing meat and how cure accelerators work with cure at higher temperatures. Most of the effect relates to fixing the color of the product and not the preservative qualities.
Take note of the comments on page 2 about how that the primary preservative in meat curing is salt and the sodium nitrite performs a follow up role in preventing botulism and enhancing flavor and color.
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This link sheds some more light on curing meat and how cure accelerators work with cure at higher temperatures. Most of the effect relates to fixing the color of the product and not the preservative qualities.
Take note of the comments on page 2 about how that the primary preservative in meat curing is salt and the sodium nitrite performs a follow up role in preventing botulism and enhancing flavor and color.
processhead That is a great article!
Short, to the point and clearly understandable.
I like the way it brings the curing process into smoking
Saved to my sausage file -
Here’s another link with basically the same info but in a slide presentation.
https://www.depts.ttu.edu/meatscience/docs/14._Curing___Smoking.pptx -
nolannn said in how does cure with ECA protect meat before its released:
But nothing really stops the growth till then?
The salt added to the meat works to inhibit bacterial growth. Salt works by drawing water out of the protein and also draws water through the cell walls of any bacteria that might be present.
The changes in available water disrupts the bacteria so they can’t multiply quickly, even in a smoker, and makes the meat a less hospitable place for them to grow.
processhead Never heard “cure” discussed in that way. Very good explanation teacher.
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nolannn said in how does cure with ECA protect meat before its released:
But nothing really stops the growth till then?
The salt added to the meat works to inhibit bacterial growth. Salt works by drawing water out of the protein and also draws water through the cell walls of any bacteria that might be present.
The changes in available water disrupts the bacteria so they can’t multiply quickly, even in a smoker, and makes the meat a less hospitable place for them to grow.
processhead Jonathan Austin I selected the up vote and it turned it to a -1 only on this thread. Now, for some reason, I can’t change it. So, the up vote should be a +1 and not a -1. In the details when I select the -1 it shows there’s 1 down vote. I could select other and different threads and perform an up vote. Probably just a system quirk.
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processhead Jonathan Austin I selected the up vote and it turned it to a -1 only on this thread. Now, for some reason, I can’t change it. So, the up vote should be a +1 and not a -1. In the details when I select the -1 it shows there’s 1 down vote. I could select other and different threads and perform an up vote. Probably just a system quirk.
zbigjeff said in how does cure with ECA protect meat before its released:
processhead Jonathan Austin I selected the up vote and it turned it to a -1 only on this thread. Now, for some reason, I can’t change it. So, the up vote should be a +1 and not a -1. In the details when I select the -1 it shows there’s 1 down vote. I could select other and different threads and perform an up vote. Probably just a system quirk.
A week or so ago several of us discovered we had inadvertently downvoted some posts. You can change them if you go to your profile.
Paul
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zbigjeff said in how does cure with ECA protect meat before its released:
processhead Jonathan Austin I selected the up vote and it turned it to a -1 only on this thread. Now, for some reason, I can’t change it. So, the up vote should be a +1 and not a -1. In the details when I select the -1 it shows there’s 1 down vote. I could select other and different threads and perform an up vote. Probably just a system quirk.
A week or so ago several of us discovered we had inadvertently downvoted some posts. You can change them if you go to your profile.
processhead Yep, was able to do it there. Thanks.
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nolannn I’ll do a post on this later, I asked this question of our application specialist on a podcast or live stream a few months ago and he gave me an answer I didn’t understand. Clearly, there are still lots of unanswered questions on the mechanism that makes the meat safe during the smoking process. I will try to get a more detailed answer and either post or do a live stream on it.
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nolannn I’ll do a post on this later, I asked this question of our application specialist on a podcast or live stream a few months ago and he gave me an answer I didn’t understand. Clearly, there are still lots of unanswered questions on the mechanism that makes the meat safe during the smoking process. I will try to get a more detailed answer and either post or do a live stream on it.
Jonathon
If ECA controls bacteria by drawing out moisture and making the meat unfavorable, then how dry do my snack sticks have to be. At 165 they aren’t super dry.
How much ECM is needed. Waltons ECA called foe 4 oc per 25 lbs. PS Seasoning is 2-10 oz per 100 lbs. If im using ECA so the meat can go in the smoker soon after mixing the cure and spices. what is the minimum.I know one thing. 4 oz per 25 lbs is too strong for me. I tried it on sticks before and it seems to compete with the seasoning. 3 oz per 25 lbs tasted better.
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Jonathon
If ECA controls bacteria by drawing out moisture and making the meat unfavorable, then how dry do my snack sticks have to be. At 165 they aren’t super dry.
How much ECM is needed. Waltons ECA called foe 4 oc per 25 lbs. PS Seasoning is 2-10 oz per 100 lbs. If im using ECA so the meat can go in the smoker soon after mixing the cure and spices. what is the minimum.I know one thing. 4 oz per 25 lbs is too strong for me. I tried it on sticks before and it seems to compete with the seasoning. 3 oz per 25 lbs tasted better.
nolannn said in how does cure with ECA protect meat before its released:
Jonathon
If ECA controls bacteria by drawing out moisture and making the meat unfavorable, then how dry do my snack sticks have to be. At 165 they aren’t super dry.
How much ECM is needed. Waltons ECA called foe 4 oc per 25 lbs. PS Seasoning is 2-10 oz per 100 lbs. If im using ECA so the meat can go in the smoker soon after mixing the cure and spices. what is the minimum.I know one thing. 4 oz per 25 lbs is too strong for me. I tried it on sticks before and it seems to compete with the seasoning. 3 oz per 25 lbs tasted better.
You may be confusing the way ECA and salt control bacteria growth. Salt is the ingredient that draws moisture from the meat and from from the cell walls of harmful bacteria. ECA on the other hand can help control bacteria growth by lowering the pH of the meat, which acts to slow the growth of bacteria.
I have noticed a lack of consistency in the amount of ECA required for sausage depending on where you get it. Different suppliers will recommend using different amounts.
Another thing to be aware of with ECA is because you are using such a small amount relative to the amount of meat, you need to make sure it gets evenly dispersed through out the meat. One little clump of ECA that is unevenly mixed in your meat can mean some of your sausage will be very sour and some not at all.
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