Thoughts for Cold Smoked sausage

[mrobisr]

Midwest_kc Well I will not get into the 160f part, but ok I see why you said it, thanks.

[Midwest_kc]

mrobisr said in Thoughts for Cold Smoked sausage:

Midwest_kc Well I will not get into the 160f part, but ok I see why you said it, thanks.

Now I’m interested… I know there are other ways to achieve lethality, by bringing to a lower temp and holding long enough. Is that what you meant?

[processhead]

I think you can do this, and certainly a lot of people have done this, but what you lose is some margin of safety.
Yes the meat is cured, but that does not mean that the meat is sterile and unable support bacterial growth. Unless you also alter the pH of the meat and reduce available water levels like is done with dry cured products, you still have a medium that can support bacterial growth during the time it is at room temperatures.

[HerbcoFood]

I actually did that growing up, make fresh sausage, no curing salt at all. Then smoke it for a few hours, then grill it, I’m still here!

[mrobisr]

Midwest_kc process head hit a couple good points that I will not reiterate on, but there is also the process of pasteurization that is a USDA approved process. This is the short version, but if you look at the regulation about middle of the book the actual charts are there. There are some caveats like fat % and humidity levels, but you can read that in the manual.

Temperature…
… Time
°F (°C)… 12% fat
136 (57.8)… 81.4 min
137 (58.3)… 65.5 min
138 (58.9)… 52.9 min
139 (59.4)… 43 min
140 (60.0)… 35 min
141 (60.6)… 28.7 min
142 (61.1)… 23.7 min
143 (61.7)… 19.8 min
144 (62.2)… 16.6 min
145 (62.8)… 13.8 min
146 (63.3)… 11.5 min
148 (64.4)… 7.7 min
150 (65.6)… 4.9 min
152 (66.7)… 2.8 min
154 (67.8)… 1.6 min
156 (68.9)… 1 min
158 (70.0)… 40.9 sec
160 (71.1)… 26.9 sec
162 (72.2)… 17.7 sec
164 (73.3)… 11.7 sec
166 (74.4)… 0 sec

Beef, Lamb, & Pork
130 (54.4) 121 minutes
135 (57.2) 37 minutes
140 (60.0) 12 minutes
145 (62.8) 4 minutes
150 (65.6) 72 seconds
155 (68.3) 23 seconds
158 (70.0) 0 seconds

Appendix-A.pdf

[mrobisr]

HerbcoFood said in Thoughts for Cold Smoked sausage:

I actually did that growing up, make fresh sausage, no curing salt at all. Then smoke it for a few hours, then grill it, I’m still here!

You wasn’t the only one that did that, I didn’t have a clue what cure was until my college days when I starting using it in a professional setting.

[Midwest_kc]

mrobisr said in Thoughts for Cold Smoked sausage:

Midwest_kc process head hit a couple good points that I will not reiterate on, but there is also the process of pasteurization that is a USDA approved process. This is the short version, but if you look at the regulation about middle of the book the actual charts are there. There are some caveats like fat % and humidity levels, but you can read that in the manual.

Temperature…
… Time
°F (°C)… 12% fat
136 (57.8)… 81.4 min
137 (58.3)… 65.5 min
138 (58.9)… 52.9 min
139 (59.4)… 43 min
140 (60.0)… 35 min
141 (60.6)… 28.7 min
142 (61.1)… 23.7 min
143 (61.7)… 19.8 min
144 (62.2)… 16.6 min
145 (62.8)… 13.8 min
146 (63.3)… 11.5 min
148 (64.4)… 7.7 min
150 (65.6)… 4.9 min
152 (66.7)… 2.8 min
154 (67.8)… 1.6 min
156 (68.9)… 1 min
158 (70.0)… 40.9 sec
160 (71.1)… 26.9 sec
162 (72.2)… 17.7 sec
164 (73.3)… 11.7 sec
166 (74.4)… 0 sec

Beef, Lamb, & Pork
130 (54.4) 121 minutes
135 (57.2) 37 minutes
140 (60.0) 12 minutes
145 (62.8) 4 minutes
150 (65.6) 72 seconds
155 (68.3) 23 seconds
158 (70.0) 0 seconds

Appendix-A.pdf

That’s what I thought you meant. I just don’t know how you’re going to get any type of pasteurization with a cold smoke though. So snack sticks or summer sausage at that point, you’d still need to cook, whether to 160 or to whatever temp you want and hold it the appropriate amount of time.

[HerbcoFood]

mrobisr said in Thoughts for Cold Smoked sausage:

HerbcoFood said in Thoughts for Cold Smoked sausage:

I actually did that growing up, make fresh sausage, no curing salt at all. Then smoke it for a few hours, then grill it, I’m still here!

You wasn’t the only one that did that, I didn’t have a clue what cure was until my college days when I starting using it in a professional setting.

Yeah, we only used it for dry sausage.

[mrobisr]

Midwest_kc during cold smoking the meat can absorb a lot more smoke and since it is a preservative in itself it adds another layer of protection. Yes I would cook after the cold smoke unless I fermented the meat then instead of cooking i would put straight into the drying chamber. It’s all depends on what you want your final product to be.

[mrobisr]

Midwest_kc to give you even more assurances about your OP, some of us do our bacon just as you talked about, cold smoke then refrigerate and freeze and cooked at a later date and it works wonderfully i have been doing it like that for years.

[Midwest_kc]

Yeah, I knew it was possible, but I never hear people talk about it. Thought maybe I was missing something.

[Dr_Pain]

Interesting process. I would not take the chance but interested in following this thread to see if it is possible without the fear of growing some food born pathogens

[processhead]

Someone mentioned cold smoking bacon and comparing it to cold smoking sausage.
In my opinion cold smoking a cured whole cut of meat is safer than cold smoking ground cured meat.
Grinding meat is an excellent way to introduce air borne bacteria into the entire batch. With a whole cut of meat you are only dealing with surface contaminants.
This is why you hear about ground beef recalls much more often then with whole cuts of meat.

[Midwest_kc]

To be clear, I would not allow the food to stay in the danger zone too long. I’m thinking if I have the sausages refrigerated, then give them, say, 2 hours of cold smoke and then back in the fridge, and then cooking them through at a later time (within a couple days, or vac sealing and freezing until I’m ready to use them).

That may not be long enough, and I could probably go up to 3 hours of smoke and still be plenty safe of the danger zone.

[mrobisr]

I would not keep it long in the fridge before consuming or freezing for the points made above, but I have done it due to unforeseen events and it worked out well. Whole muscle meats keep longer in the fridge compared to ground meat and as long as you keep that in mind you will be fine. For some that have really cold weather or during a decent cold front a person could cold smoke in the safe zone and that would even be better.

[mrobisr]

Midwest_kc sounds like a good plan.

[bleathery]

This sounds like a possible good work around for me only having a WSM smoker and living in PA cold outside temps aren’t an issue in the winter months.

[mrobisr]

bleathery in your case you might have to add heat to keep from freezing, but yes it might help in certain situations. As said earlier the safest way is to go straight to hot smoke and cooking, but sometimes that just isn’t what our schedule allows.

[Dr_Pain]

Midwest_kc said in Thoughts for Cold Smoked sausage:

To be clear, I would not allow the food to stay in the danger zone too long. I’m thinking if I have the sausages refrigerated, then give them, say, 2 hours of cold smoke and then back in the fridge, and then cooking them through at a later time (within a couple days, or vac sealing and freezing until I’m ready to use them).

That may not be long enough, and I could probably go up to 3 hours of smoke and still be plenty safe of the danger zone.

I think that is a good assumption and good plan, especially if you do it in the cold temps we are having right now