Cured Sausage: 205 Advanced Thermal Processing
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Screamin Pineapple I would absolutely recommend you dry, it contains bromelain which could be an issue as it will break down the proteins surrounding it. For Jalapenos that isn’t as much of a concern but I do still use dried flakes when I am adding it to sausage. If you have fresh jalapenos you could blanch them and then dry them out just to be safe.
Use carrot fiber at the 4 oz to 25 lb batch, her is the link to the Additive Chart but basically use .8 oz per 5 lb batch.
Yes, if you are getting a lot of moisture inside a vacuum package it can spoil the meat more quickly. You could add a longer drying phase, or check the humidity in the cooler you are holding it, sometimes holding it too long actually adds more moisture back into the sausage.
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OK, I gave it a try and appears I’m not as smart as I look!! I made three 1 lb batches to try some stuff and did not turn out well. My first time with Carrot Binder, Sure Cure, Hickory Smoke and Chili Dog Seasoning. I usually smoke and this is my first time using the water cook.
Here’s what I did
-I made 3- 1 lb batches, all of which contained 1 tbsn & 2 tspn Carrot Binder,
1/4 tsp (4 oz) Sure Cure Pink
-All were cooked in water, starting temp around 140 and up to 175.
-All were tossed into ice water when they reached 160
-All were done at the same time on the same oven top and heat measured constantly with a digital probe.
Batch 1. Added 1/2 Tsp Hickory Smoke, 3 oz of water and Callagen Casing.
Result: Really bad. Casing fell off, what casings stayed on had water in them and when I removed the lose casings, the meat was done on the inside but some had what looked like raw meat next to the casing. After they cooled were really dry and looked bad. Will probably grind and add to chili. Appeared to have spots of grease on the outside.
Batch 2. Added Chili Dog Seasoning and Callagen casing with 4 oz of water. These appear OK and taste pretty good and casings stayed on. Still kind of dry, but OK
Batch 3. Added some Summer Sausage Seasoning I had laying around and added per the package for 1#. Also added Hickory Smoke Seasoning and used Mahogany Summer Sausage Casing. The casing is not tight at all, meat loose in the casing. Meat appears to be done, but very tender and very moist.I suspect the water added and the cooking is the problem. Usually I would just try again, but with the Walton World insight and at the risk of really looking stupid, what happened?
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Screamin It sounds like you went right to the water? That would be the issue for sure. Sorry if it wasn’t more clear, what we were referring to was smoking/cooking until the internal temp of the sausage (or really anything else) reaches 130° and THEN finishing it in water. I tested the same thing you did a few times with snack sticks trying to see if I could make it work and I hade the exactl same experience that you did.
Again, sorry if we weren’t more clear on that! So smoke till 130 or so and then finish in water.
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Screamin It sounds like you went right to the water? That would be the issue for sure. Sorry if it wasn’t more clear, what we were referring to was smoking/cooking until the internal temp of the sausage (or really anything else) reaches 130° and THEN finishing it in water. I tested the same thing you did a few times with snack sticks trying to see if I could make it work and I hade the exactl same experience that you did.
Again, sorry if we weren’t more clear on that! So smoke till 130 or so and then finish in water.
Jonathon Not Walton’s fault at all, I have done enough of this that I should have known better. However, I am new to the Meat Binder products. Most recipes and bagged additives advise how much water to use. If using the Carrot Fiber, do you just use the water is recommended or, given you have the fiber, do you up the water content. If yes, is there a rule of thumb how much?
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Screamin I don’t add any extra water to mine. If I am making a cured sausage I go with 2 pints/pounds of water to a 25 lb batch. However, it can hold up to 26 times its weight in water so you could if you wanted to increase your yield or how much moisture was in your sausage. If you are adding carrot fiber you could get away with 3 pints per 25 lb batch but I wouldnt go more than that!
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Screamin I’ll throw one more out there, I like to mix the spice into the water with a wisk then drizzle onto the meat while it’s mixing. Pepper especially will pick up the water, I don’t want it to drawl moisture out of the meat. Maybe it does, maybe it doesn’t…just a best practice that works for me. Try it for yourself.
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Parksider I’ve said this somewhere else but my grandmother was an all time great cook. Seriously, she was amazing and she taught all the women and the interested men in my extended family how to cook but noone could ever make a recipe EXACTLY like hers. It wasn’t until after she died and we were splitting up her recipe book that we compared notes and realized she gave everyone 90% of her recipes but held stuff back!
That’s what you are reminding me of with this “season the water” comment! Just kidding, sounds good and I shall try that on my next batch of whatever I am making!
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Parksider I’ve said this somewhere else but my grandmother was an all time great cook. Seriously, she was amazing and she taught all the women and the interested men in my extended family how to cook but noone could ever make a recipe EXACTLY like hers. It wasn’t until after she died and we were splitting up her recipe book that we compared notes and realized she gave everyone 90% of her recipes but held stuff back!
That’s what you are reminding me of with this “season the water” comment! Just kidding, sounds good and I shall try that on my next batch of whatever I am making!
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Well, I put all my theories aside and did just what you folks suggested. Slow baked in oven, summer sausage seasoning with Waltons Hickory Smoke Seasoning and Carrot fiber. Gradually increased the temp and ended up with my best summer sausage to date. The casing was a little wrinkled, but taste and texture was great. Also did some hot dogs with the Chili Dog seasoning and some Carrot Fiber, another success. The Chili Dog Seasoning is really great. Thank for all the support.
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What does one do when your bored and it’s too cold outside… Apparently you think about humidity. Decided to try my own wet/dry bulb experiment. Although very crude the results were surprising. Found a how to on this from the UW Madison extension office. Wish I’d copied the link.
Found a psychrometer app to do the math. Lost my slide rule. Was surprised the results were pretty close. Set this up near a humidifier so there was some air movement over it. May try this in the smoker as a test as well.
Now you know what cold weather and a cold beer leads to.
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Jonathon FYI, I’ve never held back anything or not answered questions about processing…now, maybe I don’t remember to tell you something-may be an effect of the tall, domestic, and light beverage consumption!
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PapaSop So, I just saw your post and man does that deserve a round of applause. Have you used that for anything?
Get more help with your processing questions and learn more about processing meat by subscribing to our waltonsinc.com youtube page at https://wltns.link/waltonstv I am a Gorilla, love yourself
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PapaSop So, I just saw your post and man does that deserve a round of applause. Have you used that for anything?
Jonathon
Wow. So long ago. Not given it much thought until the recent posts regarding the jerky stuff. Still think about once in awhile. Wisconsin winter’s make you do weird stuff. Humidity is the key! Limited to what us home processers can do. Work in progress. -
Jonathon
Wow. So long ago. Not given it much thought until the recent posts regarding the jerky stuff. Still think about once in awhile. Wisconsin winter’s make you do weird stuff. Humidity is the key! Limited to what us home processers can do. Work in progress.PapaSop I would head down to Chippewa Falls to the Leinenkugels brewery and check for free samples, maybe tip a few at their sampling taps. Hopefully they are open during this C-19 season.
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YooperDog Leinekugel made a beer at one point tha was an amazing summer drink, something orange but light and refreshing…can’t remember the name of it!
Get more help with your processing questions and learn more about processing meat by subscribing to our waltonsinc.com youtube page at https://wltns.link/waltonstv I am a Gorilla, love yourself
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YooperDog Leinekugel made a beer at one point tha was an amazing summer drink, something orange but light and refreshing…can’t remember the name of it!
Jonathon they make a Summer Shandy and an Orange Shandy. Not sure if they are seasonal
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Cured Sausage: 205 Advanced Thermal Processing
Attend this Intermediate level class from Meatgistics University by watching the video, reading the article and post any questions you have!
Getting Started at Low Temperatures
The first thing that we want to make sure we are doing is starting the smoker at low temperatures. To avoid putting too much stress on the proteins we want to stay around 20 degrees from the animals living temperature. A hogs temperature is a little warmer than humans, right around 101° Fahrenheit so we want to start our smoking process around 120°. The other thing we want to do at the start is to dry the outside of the product. For most home smokers this will simply mean opening the top and bottom dampers to allow air to travel through the chamber and dry the surface of the product. This drying stage should usually last around an hour, if you skip this step you will have problems with smoke adhesion and you might end up with a streaky appearance on the surface of your sausage. If you are planning on using a water pan in your smoker I recommend that you NOT add it during this first hour to get the full benefit from the drying phase.
Then, once we are past the drying stage we want to close the dampers down and begin the cooking process by stepping up the temperature gradually. If you try to go directly from 120° to 170° you run the risk of cooking the outside of the sausage too quickly, this is called case hardening and this is how you end up with a product that is overcooked on the outside and under-cooked on the inside. Slowly increasing the temperature will allow the outside of the meat to transfer heat to the interior of the meat easier.
Relative Humidity
A very important factor when you are smoking any piece of meat is the relative humidity. You’ve heard us talk about the water holding capacity of meat a lot in the past, well Relative Humidity is the water holding capacity of the air and being able to increase that can speed up your cooking process and give you a juicier finished product. Most people at home do not have a way to control the relative humidity in their smokers and just put a pan of water in there, which is better than nothing but it is a shot in the dark. A psychrometer is something that a commercial smokehouse would have that will have both a Dry Bulb and a Wet Bulb and by getting those two reading it can give you the relative humidity.
So, placing a pan of water took our relative humidity from about 10% up to 15%, which as I said, is better than nothing but it isn’t going to make a ton of difference. So I started thinking of ways to increase that. There are a bunch of chemicals you can add to water to make it evaporate quicker but they are not ones that you want around food, you could disturb the waters surface with a constantly moving paddle, you circulate air through it or you can increase the surface area of the water.
The surface area of the water seemed the most doable to me so I have been doing some experimenting with ways to do this. In my pk 100 I took 3 large auto cleaning sponges, soaked them and then placed them so they were mostly out of the water, the sponges will continue to suck up water through them and will offer a better surface for evaporation. When I did this I was able to top out at 50% relative humidity with an average of 47%. I’d call that a pretty significant improvement from the 15% I was getting from a water pan alone.
Next, I bought a dry wick towel and laid it out on a rack above the water pan and draped part of it over and into the water to try to keep it moist. My thought was that this type of towel, much like the sponge would stay moist as it could draw water up from the pan. With this set up I topped out at 54.1% and had an average of 50.1%. I also tried a mop head and a regular towel but these were not as effective.
Finishing In Water
The last one I want to bring up is pulling your meat out of the smoker and finishing it up in water. I have been doing some testing here on this method and I think it has a lot of promise. So far I have found that the best results are when you smoke it to 130-140° and then move it to water that is a steady 170°. Usually, the 130-160° range takes 3 or more hours, depending on your relative humidity, from 140° your sausage should be up to temp in one hour. Surprisingly putting it in a vacuum bag does not seem to make a noticeable difference in the quality of the meat or the amount of smoke flavor. I am still going to recommend you vacuum bag it for an extra level of safety but plenty of people are doing it without them. One note, if you DO use a vacuum bag and you want to see what the temperature is, make a small cut in the up near the seal, insert your thermometer and then you don’t need a new vac bag if it needs to be cooked longer.
Special Thanks
Parksider and gadahl deserve a ton of the credit for the above section (Finishing In Water) as it was gadahl’s great post titled “Summer Sausage Nightmare” that brought up the idea to us and Parksider that recommended it. Since then I have used this technique 4 times and it has never failed!
Shop waltonsinc.com for PK 100 Pro Smoker Smokehouse
Jonathon Sorry to get off of the beer topic since it is a great topic as well. I have a full size steam pan that I use for finishing in hot water. I place it across 2 burners on my stove. The problem is that I have to constantly monitor water temp to keep it around 160. Would the Sous Vide heater clamp to a 6" deep steam pan?
2nd question. Is there any consistency difference in the meat when only going to 130-140 and then straight to a hot water bath? I usually leave summer sausage in the smoker over night (just so I can get some sleep) and then put it in the HWB in the morning. It is usually still in the stall stage and probably has been for several hours. (142) I haven’t had any issues though.
If I can pull it out when the INT is 130-140 that would save hours. -
chrisndee2 no worries! I thought this was my favorite drink topic, so our posts don’t belong, yours does! So, as you can see the HBC (one on the left) has a minimum water level at about 4.25" and the Wesotn has its around 3". The Weston also has a moveable clamp and is significantly cheaper. The downside is that it does not heat as much water as the HBC but you could pretty much by 2 for the price of one of the HBC.
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Jonathon Sorry to get off of the beer topic since it is a great topic as well. I have a full size steam pan that I use for finishing in hot water. I place it across 2 burners on my stove. The problem is that I have to constantly monitor water temp to keep it around 160. Would the Sous Vide heater clamp to a 6" deep steam pan?
2nd question. Is there any consistency difference in the meat when only going to 130-140 and then straight to a hot water bath? I usually leave summer sausage in the smoker over night (just so I can get some sleep) and then put it in the HWB in the morning. It is usually still in the stall stage and probably has been for several hours. (142) I haven’t had any issues though.
If I can pull it out when the INT is 130-140 that would save hours.chrisndee2 I know this is and older post, but what about and induction cooktop. The one I have has a temperature setting, so to set it at say 176 for 3 hours would solve the temp problem. Just and idea that I haven’t seen posted.
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